Critique the shot (Last one)

[Buckfever]

12 feet up, 5 yards away, broadside.

This one is a little bit of a trick question, really directed at the less experienced bowhunter. I'll have some comments on this one at the end, after others chime in. But I'll go ahead and show the exit right off.

What I want you to do, is look at the body of the deer. You're only 5 yards away, where the hell do you have to put that arrow so that it passes through the center of the chest cavity?



Here's the exit of the top arrow pushed through:

[ncboman]

ok, when you say 12ft up, is that to your bow or your feet? Got to be to the bow because 5yd shots to me are much much steeper than that, of course I'm up about 24-25ft to the bow.

On your angle and shot, I'd aim a little more back and up, trying to exit where that hole is in the tape idealy.

While killers for sure, most of your shots are just a little bit closer to the shoulder than I prefer on a real deer.

Actually I don't like going any farther forward than your arrows here. I try for a clean pass thru the ribs and view that shoulder, perhaps 2" forward of your arrows, as my forward limit. The etched kill zone on the bottom pic shows about where the lungs end and the liver is behind that. Plenty of room to the back of your arrows for a clean kill and guaranteed passthru.

[Buckfever]

Oh heck now you're going to make me measure it ;-) Alright I'll check it.

[Buckfever]

9.5' to the top of the joist +1" for the plywood and ceramic tile +1.5' for the chair I'm standing on.

11' 1" +/- an inch to my feet.

If you look at the picture, I have carpeting under the cross support of the stand for the 3-d target to keep it a little more stable. That angles the target back a bit, so that's probably why the angle isn't as steep as it would be. Damn sharp observation. In the field the 5 yard shots are a good bit steeper.

[ncboman]

no fair using typsy deer on shot placement threads. ;D

Deer hunting from a stand height of 20 or 22 ft, 5yds is almost straight down, difficult to cleanly double lung. That's when the spine between the shoulder blades becomes very attractive.

One reason I like my shots at 18yds is because the steep angle becomes more likeable at that distance.

[Twanger]

yeah, that's about as far forward as I like. Also, for steep angles I like the arrow to hit higher because it's gonna come out low on the other side. One to two inches above center-line is what I like for shots around 8-10 yds from a tree-stand height of 22 feet.

[Buckfever]

I think, 2-3" higher. If you look at the first picture, consider the consequences of the deer jumping away, spinning left and spinning right so that your shot winds up 2-3 inches lower, 2-3 inches back and 2-3 inches forward.

And this is just my observation. But every animal that I've observed that drops at the shot drops away from the shot, or drops and spins away in one direction or another. When it's 15 yards away holding lower makes sense, because given the angle that it drops away from the shot doesn't really matter, that it drops does. But up close that the deer will drop away or spin away will make the low hold not so good. So up close I need a higher hold.

IMO that is the benefit of practice on the 3-d target. If you aim where I aimed on that target, invariably a few shots will get away from you and you'll see the consequences and that leads to better shot selection. By practicing on the 3-D target, you develop an eye for aiming automatically where the arrow needs to go to pass through the center of the chest cavity. IMO this is something that is not very hard to develop but must be automatic.

"Pick a spot" is something you hear all the time in bowhunting circles. The problem with that is that it usually is the same spot regardless of the angle or the steepness of the shot. Top of the crease or right behind the shoulder are common references.

My suggestion is to start looking at the deers chest and when you think "Pick a spot" you're thinking "center of the chest cavity".

I think also this may be part of the reason why I don't get nervous at all when I'm on a deer. I am so focused on getting the arrow through the center of the chest that everything else gets blocked out. It does require more than simply picking a spot on the side of the deer.

ncboman, has made this comment to me over the years, that it's hard for him in 3-D shooting to aim for the score when the most lethal shot placement is well away from what is needed for optimal scoring.

And that's what I'm talking about. Developing your aiming so that it's hard to move away from what is the most lethal shot.

[ncboman]

I think also this may be part of the reason why I don't get nervous at all when I'm on a deer. I am so focused on getting the arrow through the center of the chest that everything else gets blocked out.

very interesting statement.

On more than one occasion I've had my knees melt and the wind leave me almost completely, esp dealing with big bucks. If a deer is moving along as expected, I'm usually fine and as the deal closes I can get focused on the vitals. If something starts going off cue, I can go to pieces and I know it.

I think a good deal of the issue is if the deer is in range. Once in range I can focus on the kill, as buckfever does, but before they get in range, it can be a strange world for me.

It can even get crazy in range. I once had a giant 8pt in Illinois come to a funnel point I was setup on and he stopped about 14yds from me but under and on the other side of a tree full of low limbs. Wind was very light and ok but would falter on occasion causing me much worry as I watched him cycle from at ease to concerned and then back at ease. He did this over and over for 20 full minutes without taking a step. By the time he walked out perfectly I had gone thru the meltdown so many times I flubbed a gimme shot, missing him completely.

I can remember at least another half dozen times I've gone thru meltdown over big bucks but that one sticks out as I actually finally got the shot offered I had planned on.

[Twanger]

Interesting, Bowman. Kinda mirrors my own experiences. It's usually best for my nerves if the encounter happens relatively quickly. Just last year I had a doe slowly feed towards me for 30 minutes, and I got so jazzed up waiting for my chance that when I finally got my shot, at a range of 12 yards, I flinched so bad that I missed her by 2 feet.

This doesn't ever seem to happen to me when I have a gun in hand - to me, shooting deer through a scoped rifle is like playing a video-game.