|
Post by Buckfever on Jan 24, 2006 16:19:07 GMT -5
Here's some useful info: forums.mathewsinc.com/bulletinboards/snitz/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=26925I see the Birth certificate is based on a 30" draw and 71lbs, so if I figure 35 grains on the string and a 389grain arrow at 29" and 70lbs, I calculate 278 so it's not that bad, probably just a little out of specs. All I have on mine is a string loop and a trupeep, so I gain a little there, plus I pull 73lbs plus I keep everything to specs all the time. How is the draw? It's got to feel pretty light for you, I'd at least try the speed mods.
|
|
|
Post by Buckfever on Jan 24, 2006 16:30:49 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Buckfever on Jan 24, 2006 16:38:44 GMT -5
One more: www.huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=1393846It sounds though like you need to get the bow to the proper ATA with the bow bottomed out and with the cams in the correct timing as indicated by the mark, relative to the limbs. Sounds like Bowtech tech support could give you the exact measures you need. I'm pretty sure Len will be on it though. Sounds very similar to what I have to do with the Mathews except that you've got 2 cams to put in the optimal position. But then I have to get the idler lean out for the thing to tune.
|
|
|
Post by Twanger on Jan 24, 2006 18:31:15 GMT -5
If your arrows are in the 380's that's another 10-12 fps of speed reduction vs. a 350gr arrow. So... 10 for string stuff, 10 for 1" of draw, and 10 for heavier arrows is 30 fps. Adds up fast eh? So nock off 30 fps from 315 and you get 285... sounds like you're in the ball-park. I have not chronied my Old Glory with the 415gr arrows I'm using now, but it was throwing 358gr arrows 270 fps with 70lb draw and 27.5" draw length. The old-Glory is not the speed bow that the Allegiance or Tribute is, but it's not bad. The Brace height is bigger (8" vs. 7 and 7.5) and the cam is softer. It's REAL quiet shooting those 415gr planks @ 73lb draw. Just the way I like it.
|
|
|
Post by freedomrules3 on Jan 24, 2006 18:31:43 GMT -5
I gotta ask these questions, cause i'm still just not getting it 1) have you target shot it and how does it shoot for you? 2) does it feel "right" in your hands, comfortable? 3) think it will kill a deer? 4) can you see the arrow in flight? 5) will 10 or 20 fps really make any difference at all within 35 yards or less? i can see the confusion of having a birth certificate of 315 and only getting 272 , you gotta remember everything you put on the bow slows it down some. i've shot tons of deer with my old hoyt that probably only shot 185 fps or so. my darton is slow by todays standards at somewhere around 235 fps yet it killed 4 this year with no problems. i also understand the flatness of a quicker shooting bow but at that speed (272) it will shoot plenty flat. why worry about a few fps if it feels as good as you said it did? is it just for braggin rights or to hunt with? i think like i said before this is a primary reason why they can charge double what all these newer bows are worth and get away with it . it will work just fine and hit a deer in a 1/4 of a second after release , what more do you want ?
|
|
|
Post by eshoremd on Jan 24, 2006 19:39:33 GMT -5
i have to disagree with ya rick. its no different than buying a muscle car. sure it will get you from point a to b but if the advertisement says it will do 13 flat in the quarter mile and it only does 13.5 somethings not right. the car still serves its purpose but your not getting what you paid for.
plus alan has a great point about shooting flatter.
i want what i paid for. im not flaming the bow or len. i just want to know if its normal. i dont know. len said it was and im sure hes not lying on purpose. maybe theres something he doesnt know that'll make'em a little faster. just trying to gather some info.
|
|
|
Post by Buckfever on Jan 24, 2006 19:40:00 GMT -5
It's a good point about the speed and I actually prefer a little slower speed so I went up to the ACC's to gain a little weight and slow it down. For me anyway it is more about having the power to push a little more cut and to get a little better penetration for when it's needed. The other thing also, is that these bows are quieter when they are setup in their optimal position.
|
|
|
Post by freedomrules3 on Jan 24, 2006 20:15:06 GMT -5
I can understand where you are coming from to some extent Todd, they advertise 300 plus fps, and its not doing it. i believe like all hunting equipment these days , they go overboard trying to outdo the other brands. what i'm saying is if you had never chronoed it at all you would probably be pumped about it. everything these days is not quite up to the advertisers promises (immortal ring anyone ) what i'm saying is its more than plenty good to hunt with, the main objective is to hit the spot every time it gets shot. what if you return it for one that does shoot 300 + and your not comfortable with it and cant shoot well with it? 10 fps isnt that much when your talking less than a second to make the kill. i'm also cranky because of my back and leg are still killing me and i have cabin fever
|
|
|
Post by ncboman on Jan 24, 2006 20:22:11 GMT -5
I've never met Len but I doubt there's much he doesn't know about bows. Bowers, who posts here, also is sharp on the modern equipt imo. I understand your point and concerns but don't fall into the trap of letting a chrono decide your satisfaction with a bow. One of my bows will shoot well over 20 fps faster but my hunting configuration and tune has it shooting approx 274. Quietness, accuracy, and ease of use are more important than extra fps once a certain speed range is achieved. Like Buckfever, I don't want my arrows too fast anyway. Pushing most decent broadheads over 280 is really full of hinks no matter the bow. Most of us probably think it would be cool to have a bow that would make a chrono pee on the floor but in reality being able to reach out and touch at will is way coolest.
|
|
|
Post by Buckfever on Jan 24, 2006 21:36:59 GMT -5
BTW This is a real good calculator, but you really need to figure everything on the string. So for this Tribute with the Smooth Mods you have to figure 313 to adjust for the extra lb of draw. bucklemke.com/ke/ke.php
|
|
|
Post by freedomrules3 on Jan 25, 2006 11:26:35 GMT -5
how many times did you shoot through the chrono? are you sure you just didnt get a false reading? did you paper shoot it any to see if the flight is right? is the release hanging up on the loop any? it doesnt take much to lose speed. 43 fps off the birth certificate just doesnt seem right, unless you got a false reading. i would shoot it through at least 5 times myself and try to get an average from that.
|
|
|
Post by Buckfever on Jan 25, 2006 14:20:21 GMT -5
One thing that is bothering me is, how did you get a 29" draw? Did Len change out the cams? Because those cams are draw length specific.
|
|
|
Post by Twanger on Jan 25, 2006 17:36:30 GMT -5
Len changed out the cams for me on the Old Glory to make it 27.5"
|
|
|
Post by eshoremd on Jan 29, 2006 19:47:28 GMT -5
this is the reply i got from bowtech. either way i will be having len bump up the poundage, its VERY easy for me to draw and hold. i read that your bow should be at about 75% of your max ability to draw. id say this is at 50% most. will be switching to the speed mod. what do you guys think of switching from 100 grain muzzy's to 75 grain. they are the same cutting diameter. people switch from 125 to 100 all the time. what would be so bad about going down to 75. all these changes should move me up from 272 to 298?
Todd,
A couple things you need to consider when figuring speed are that arrows weighing more than the advertised 5 grains per pound will slow the bow down and adding accessories to the bow string do too.
My calculations show that at the specs you’re shooting and with the accessories you have on it your bow is shooting where it should be.
Regards,
|
|
|
Post by ncboman on Jan 29, 2006 20:51:51 GMT -5
Todd,
A chronograph is a good tool for comparing bow and arrow configurations but using it as a measure of your bow is not hitting the bullseye.
Remember this, the most accurate bows do not shoot 300fps and none of the top archers do either. There's nothing wrong with wanting to know just what your setup will do but settin a bow up for speed and getting it will eventually cause you to reconsider your goals and purposes with a bow.
Speed bows aren't particularly fun to shoot, primarily because they are so touchy precision accuracy can be fleeting.
At some point, the cadillac draw and being spot on became more important to me than a high number on a screen. It'll be interesting to see if you hit a point where you have to back up to have fun again. ;D
|
|